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TOPIC: Pitino

Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338702

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Pitino is a homerun. Hurley is a double. I like Cluess as a coach and a person but that is a swing and a miss.

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Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338704

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Strongly doubt Pitino happens
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Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338705

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Paultzman wrote: Strongly doubt Pitino happens


Thanks Paultz. You think it's >50-50 we get Hurley unless ASU donors drive a Brinks$$$$ truck into his garage?
And my other Question is what timeline does 'anything' happen over?
This week or later?
Thanks again.

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Last edit: by Chicago Days.

Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338708

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Logen wrote:

stjohnschris wrote: Pitino instantly puts us on the map, simple as that. Bobby H would do well for us, not a doubt. I wasn't impressed with his ASU team in their game against us, but I have faith that he would bring a level of coaching and recruiting here that we haven't seen in a long time. I suppose the dream is that one of those two options works out.


Not sure I even want to get into Pitino because, while a completely personal thing , his hiring would end my more than 50 years as a Redmen fan. I realize non one should or would care about that so let my only other comments be practical. Have any of you many fans clamoring for his hire given a thought to what that would look like? For all the Pollyanna reformation tour talk do any of you really not understand there was a lot more dirt about his time at Louisville leading to his dismissal than has been made public? Have any of you given any thought to the field day the NY media will have uncovering that dirt? Not to mention the innuendos / rumors that will become part of that tabloid feeding frenzy? Do you really think a program reeling over decades of mismanagement, poor on-court performances, strip clubs, marijuana instances, the Rysheed Jordan fiasco, etc. can take that kind of gamble? Sure Pitino wants the job, and yes, no one can deny his coaching ability. But I own a risk/reward business and to me, regardless of personal feelings, the risk SJU would be taking hiring him would just not be the worth the potential reward. Because remember, great coaches are great coaches because they get great players and Pitino has never played it straight in getting those great players. Anyone think at 66 that leopard is going to change his spots? I sure don't. And neither will the NCAA.; SJU as sacrificial lamb anyone???


It's impossible to know what the media would do with a Pitino/SJU combo, but winning and staying out of trouble would garner positive press. You reference several debacles and missteps by former players, coaches, admin, etc. All true. How long do we hold ourselves down for that? Realize it's self imposed at this point, and at best very very old news to anyone who is not an avid St John's basketball fan. People screw up, some do it under a spotlight, and no matter the 100% truth, it doesn't look good at all for a high profile coach at a top ranked school. I can understand why some don't want Pitino for moral reasons, I just not one of them.
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Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338719

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It is not just "moral reasons" it is for the reasons Logen stated, plus more. And, "moral reasons" are different in the context of a Catholic University than, say, the Univ. of Nebraska. While I fully realize that "Catholic Universities", even the best of them today are watered down partially secular versions of themselves from decades ago, they are still Catholic Universities. If SJU ever wants to ever be able to sell itself as a mission-based school that values Catholic principles, then you CAN NOT hire Pitino.

Of course, by basketball standards he is the best possible candidate, and one who would definitely bring basketball success. Only an idiot would not understand that. But hiring him would destroy any pretense that SJU is a Catholic University worth its stripes.

To the Vincentians and a lot of alums (mostly older I would concede) that matters. But older alliums buy tickets and donate to the school. And, are the backbone of the historical reputation of SJU as a place worth attending.

You can't look at hiring Pitino strictly thru the prism of basketball. Hell, by that standard, we should have hired Jerry Tarkanian back in the day.

Nope, the reason that there is ZERO chance he is hired here is precisely because he can't be.

Those who believe otherwise are fooling yourselves, don't understand the dynamic or don't care. A lot of hot air has been spent on this site in the past 18 hours pining over something that will NEVER happen.



stjohnschris wrote:

Logen wrote:

stjohnschris wrote: Pitino instantly puts us on the map, simple as that. Bobby H would do well for us, not a doubt. I wasn't impressed with his ASU team in their game against us, but I have faith that he would bring a level of coaching and recruiting here that we haven't seen in a long time. I suppose the dream is that one of those two options works out.


Not sure I even want to get into Pitino because, while a completely personal thing , his hiring would end my more than 50 years as a Redmen fan. I realize non one should or would care about that so let my only other comments be practical. Have any of you many fans clamoring for his hire given a thought to what that would look like? For all the Pollyanna reformation tour talk do any of you really not understand there was a lot more dirt about his time at Louisville leading to his dismissal than has been made public? Have any of you given any thought to the field day the NY media will have uncovering that dirt? Not to mention the innuendos / rumors that will become part of that tabloid feeding frenzy? Do you really think a program reeling over decades of mismanagement, poor on-court performances, strip clubs, marijuana instances, the Rysheed Jordan fiasco, etc. can take that kind of gamble? Sure Pitino wants the job, and yes, no one can deny his coaching ability. But I own a risk/reward business and to me, regardless of personal feelings, the risk SJU would be taking hiring him would just not be the worth the potential reward. Because remember, great coaches are great coaches because they get great players and Pitino has never played it straight in getting those great players. Anyone think at 66 that leopard is going to change his spots? I sure don't. And neither will the NCAA.; SJU as sacrificial lamb anyone???


It's impossible to know what the media would do with a Pitino/SJU combo, but winning and staying out of trouble would garner positive press. You reference several debacles and missteps by former players, coaches, admin, etc. All true. How long do we hold ourselves down for that? Realize it's self imposed at this point, and at best very very old news to anyone who is not an avid St John's basketball fan. People screw up, some do it under a spotlight, and no matter the 100% truth, it doesn't look good at all for a high profile coach at a top ranked school. I can understand why some don't want Pitino for moral reasons, I just not one of them.

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Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338724

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Logen wrote:

stjohnschris wrote: Pitino instantly puts us on the map, simple as that. Bobby H would do well for us, not a doubt. I wasn't impressed with his ASU team in their game against us, but I have faith that he would bring a level of coaching and recruiting here that we haven't seen in a long time. I suppose the dream is that one of those two options works out.


Not sure I even want to get into Pitino because, while a completely personal thing , his hiring would end my more than 50 years as a Redmen fan. I realize non one should or would care about that so let my only other comments be practical. Have any of you many fans clamoring for his hire given a thought to what that would look like? For all the Pollyanna reformation tour talk do any of you really not understand there was a lot more dirt about his time at Louisville leading to his dismissal than has been made public? Have any of you given any thought to the field day the NY media will have uncovering that dirt? Not to mention the innuendos / rumors that will become part of that tabloid feeding frenzy? Do you really think a program reeling over decades of mismanagement, poor on-court performances, strip clubs, marijuana instances, the Rysheed Jordan fiasco, etc. can take that kind of gamble? Sure Pitino wants the job, and yes, no one can deny his coaching ability. But I own a risk/reward business and to me, regardless of personal feelings, the risk SJU would be taking hiring him would just not be the worth the potential reward. Because remember, great coaches are great coaches because they get great players and Pitino has never played it straight in getting those great players. Anyone think at 66 that leopard is going to change his spots? I sure don't. And neither will the NCAA.; SJU as sacrificial lamb anyone???


you are being very dishonest! Maybe with yourself first and foremost. Pitino took Providence to the final 4 in what year 2. Pitino took over Kentucky right after Sutton got caught with Casey paying Chris Mills through was it fed ex? The program was on probation and looking at the death penalty if anything else happened. He took that program over when no one would commit. He had 5 walk ons and built a monster program. Was he dirty then? He won a Natl Champ with Kentucky, and his kids won with Tubby Smith when he left. He was at Louisville for 15 seasons. The FBi has tons of transcripts for you to review, and read testimony online. No mention of Pitino in anything, not audio, nothing, plenty on Miller and even Self. No PItino. He has a 5 game suspension to serve for failure to supervise for the escort thing with his assistant coach, but the NCAA and local authorities cleared him of being involved. So really what are you talking about??
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Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338726

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This is the way I see it:

Pitino would be on his best behavior and may even come cheaper like others have said. Last hurrah at home while grooming assistant for 5 years or so. He's not going to any other program, he'd just retire after us. Hurley would be poached after 4 or 5 yrs if he is successful at SJ anyway best case. Pitino is the type of guy you'd say "if _____ can't do it then no one can" as coach. We would get free publicity nationally all over and they'd be talking about us so much we'd feel like Duke for a week. As someone else said, this day in age the news cycle is so fast. Yes there would be a few opinion pieces on why hiring Pitino was morally wrong, but Dick Vitale and other major pundits would go to bat for him in defense, helping that perception. When someone starts a business, they need to take a chance to get rich. Rarely do you just inherit that type of thing. Big risk equals big reward sometimes. The big risk is necessary to get a once in a lifetime talent like Pitino. I still think he should be #1 and if we still ask Hurley and he says no, we have to get Pitino and no one else. No Cluess from the MAAC. I'd still be happy with Hurley but we cannot compete with ASU money wise if they really want to keep him. May not be as sure a thing as others are making it seem.
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Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338737

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Logen wrote:

stjohnschris wrote: Pitino instantly puts us on the map, simple as that. Bobby H would do well for us, not a doubt. I wasn't impressed with his ASU team in their game against us, but I have faith that he would bring a level of coaching and recruiting here that we haven't seen in a long time. I suppose the dream is that one of those two options works out.


Not sure I even want to get into Pitino because, while a completely personal thing , his hiring would end my more than 50 years as a Redmen fan. I realize non one should or would care about that so let my only other comments be practical. Have any of you many fans clamoring for his hire given a thought to what that would look like? For all the Pollyanna reformation tour talk do any of you really not understand there was a lot more dirt about his time at Louisville leading to his dismissal than has been made public? Have any of you given any thought to the field day the NY media will have uncovering that dirt? Not to mention the innuendos / rumors that will become part of that tabloid feeding frenzy? Do you really think a program reeling over decades of mismanagement, poor on-court performances, strip clubs, marijuana instances, the Rysheed Jordan fiasco, etc. can take that kind of gamble? Sure Pitino wants the job, and yes, no one can deny his coaching ability. But I own a risk/reward business and to me, regardless of personal feelings, the risk SJU would be taking hiring him would just not be the worth the potential reward. Because remember, great coaches are great coaches because they get great players and Pitino has never played it straight in getting those great players. Anyone think at 66 that leopard is going to change his spots? I sure don't. And neither will the NCAA.; SJU as sacrificial lamb anyone???


While I understand your point I think you're missing two bigger ones. Re the NCAA issues regarding recruiting Pitino is only damaged goods in some eyes because he got "caught" wiothout getting caught. Self is about to get "caught". Cal got caught over and over and again. Roy Williams keeps getting caught and then squirming away. Coach K gets caught and then the news squashed. Wooden got caught 20 years later. Dozens of other big and not so big names have or have not been caught. They're all doing what it takes to do the job nowadays given the draconian NCAA rules and the efforts of everyone outside the NCAA (shoes, agents, AAU, etc) to figure out ways to circumvent them. At the end of the day to most basketball fans none of this matters in any way whatsoever come March unless they're trying to denigrate a rival. And if the expected changes to NCAA rules eventuate then none of this will matter anyway as programs and coaches will have to figure out all new ways to cheat.

The 2nd issue is that St Johns is barely relevant to the NY media and totally irrelevant everywhere else. The National exposure of hiring Pitino will make a few waves at the beginning but because it's St Johns and no one outside this board really cares any minor hullabaloo will blow over quickly and without incident but the name Pitino as a coaching giant will remain attached to the program.

Remember there is no show cause order attached to Rick Pitino. And I wholly understand he will not be hired but as a fan who just wants to win I would certainly support the move if it had happened.

I understand as a non alum, just basketball fan, it is easier for me to look at this from an outsider perspective and justify at least considering this hire from a Just Win Baby perspective.
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Last edit: by austour.

Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338742

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Paultzman wrote: Strongly doubt Pitino happens


We'll get bobby, some high will gamble on rick, watch rick get them to the f4 within 3yrs.
Oh well, such is life as a sju fan

Edit
Bobby might get us to the f4 but would take 5 or 6 yrs

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Last edit: by oldschool Redmen.

Pitino 8 months 2 days ago #338758

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If SJU can't get Patino or Hurley it will end up a disaster.
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